e46m
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Posts: 6
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Post by e46m on Jun 24, 2024 17:49:39 GMT
As title says, I plan on importing my 2024 GTI to Europe and need help with preparing it to meet the import requirements and to switch the MIB to Euro maps, radio, etc. In case it matters, the car is the Canadian 'Performance' model which is Autobahn in rest of the world.
One of the requirements is the rear fog light. This car comes with base Euro taillights which seem to have a fog LED built in but I need to run a wire from the left inner taillight to the connection point in the footwell, and source/install the Euro headlight switch with the foglight option. Does anyone know how to code the car to enable the fog light option once I complete the hardware upgrade?
My other question is related to updating the MIB to Euro maps, radio, etc. Does anyone know what's involved to accomplish this?
Finally, does anyone know of any other differences I should consider which I haven't already mentioned? Would there be any difference in the engine tune because of different fuel grade? Euro cars use Euro 95 which is the equivalent of Canadian 91 Octane but VW Canada recommends 87 Octane fuel here in Canada. Not sure if the engine tune is different as a result. Anyone know?
Apologies if some of these items don't belong on this forum but I figured they are all software/coding related.
Thanks in advance for your help!
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Post by dv52 (Australia) on Jun 25, 2024 1:19:18 GMT
e46m : Hi. Clearly because I live on an isolated island just North of Antarctica, I don't have any experience with cars from either country for this project!! Nevertheless, I reply to dispel what I think might be a misunderstanding about the rear fog-light. My apology if I am incorrect about the term "misunderstanding" - blame it on my heavy Aussie accent!! 
I'm not sure what you mean by "This car comes with base Euro taillights" given that it is a Canadian vehicle! Notwithstanding that Canada has it's own vehicle standards - I understand that cars from Canada are fundamentally "Yankee" vehicles, which means that they are what VW calls "North America Region" (NAR) models. Europe however uses EU model cars (unsurprisingly!). So the factory installed tail-lights on NAR models are different to those on EU models normally!
I'm also uncertain what is meant by your explanation of the fog-light exercise. It appears to me from your words that you may believe that the new Euro-switch is directly connected to the fog-light, perhaps? Again my apology if I have misunderstood - but this car is built on a MQB-evo platform which means that both the Euro-switch and the rear fog-lights are directly connected to the module that OBD11 calls the central electrics module.
You can think about the set-up on this car as the module being an intermediary central controller - with the Euro-switch being an input to the module (it tells the module when to switch On/OFF the lamps) and the power-supply for the fog-lights being an output from the module.
So, I suspect ONLY if this car was factory built with NO rear fog-lights will a new Euro-switch be required. If you just need to add another rear fog-light, the connections can be made in the boot-lid coupling point (I think)
As for MiB question - VW SATNAV is what's called SWAP (Software As Product) which means that monet is paid to VW for a license for the facility. The license is called a FEC (Facility Enablement Code) and it's generated by VW software to be tailored to each car's individual VIN.
When this Canadian car was built, the FEC for the SATNAV was installed into the MIB specifically for the Canada region. When you migrate this car to Europe, the factory installed FEC will not be usable because of the different region (I think)- alas.
That said, I suspect stuff like frequency changes to the radio will be able to be modified via coding changes. So, I guess that it really depends on how highly you value the VW SATNAV and how much money you are prepared to throw at a new FEC. I seldom use the VW SATNAV these days - I prefer mobile phone Apps like WAZ and Google - they tend to be far more accurate and the data is more up-to-date
I can't see any problems with the petrol/gas standards!
Don
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e46m
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Post by e46m on Jun 25, 2024 2:19:48 GMT
Hi Don, Thanks very much for your response. By 'base Euro tails' I mean to say that the car doesn't have the fancy IQ tails which are available on the Euro MK8 GTI. Instead, the Canadian (and US) MK8 GTI is only available with the simplistic taillights which come on the 'base' Euro MK8 golfs. They literally look identical and seem to operate exactly the same way (unlike MK7 which had very different taillights in Europe vs NAR) other than the Euro version having an operational fog light LED in the inner housing (LHD in the left, RHD in the right). NAR cars do not have the fog light option enabled - the light switch module is missing that field and the car is missing the wire (I already checked) but the taillight assembly appears to have the fog LED within it, in the exact same place as the 'base Euro MK8 golf' has it, the one that uses the same taillights. I removed my left inner tail light assembly and found that the LED PCB has an unused fog light pin which is missing the wire. I looked at the same part on E-bay from a Euro car and that missing wire is there. This makes me believe that all I need to do is run the wire, get the light switch and code the car. The reason I felt the need to clarify which taillights I'm working with is because most NAR guys are drooling over and swapping in the IQ tails from Euro market cars and there is an option on the market to retrofit those (https://acmtechnik.com/products/mk8-iq-tail-lights-with-direct-to-bcm-harness). This package includes the coding required to make these work on NAR cars, including enabling the rear fog light. This is made possible by the custom wiring harness provided which also runs a wire lead from the left inner tail light assembly to a specific 73 pin connector in the footwell (not light switch directly). So... I'm looking to retain my NAR taillights and make the rear fog light functional. I want to run the wire from the fog LED pin in the inner left taillight to the 73 pin connector in the footwell and along with installing the compatible switch from an European car, enable the fog function via OBD11 (I guess within the central electronics module you mentioned). Clearly, this is possible as it's offered as a service by the company I linked above, but since I'm not looking for the full IQ light upgrade, I'm hoping to be able to do the coding myself with some help from experts such as yourself. Hope that makes more sense! Now, do you know how to enable the fog light function? Regarding the MIB - thanks very much for explaining that in detail. I very much value the SATNAV - I plan on using this car for travelling around Europe for many years and I don't want to use cellular data for maps (apple CarPlay). I want to have the full SATNAV functionality and I'm willing to pay for that, granted it's even possible to enable the Euro region/maps on the car. I found many threads online of people trying to do this without success, even through VW. Here are a couple of examples: www.golfmk7.com/forums/index.php?threads/golf-r-from-america-euro-map-help.371925/ www.vwvortex.com/threads/update-gps-map-with-european.9537138/?post_id=116305332&nested_view=1&sortby=reaction#post-116305332Petrol difference is probably the least of my concerns. My guess is that the engine tune is identical... but I figured I'd confirm if possible. |
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Post by blizzard60 on Jun 25, 2024 6:17:55 GMT
Hey, I checked the P/N and Euro “low” tails seem to the the same P/N in ROW as in NAR. VW has been notoriously weird about making completely different parts instead of using the same parts with disabled functionality, so I’m surprised to see this, and I may be wrong. My initial *guess* was the fog light would not be functional, but I haven’t tested in my car, and if you test, you might be pleasantly surprised!
I’d suggest the best way to find out is pop the wire outta one of the other lights, for example the reverse light, and into the fog spot (T8ag/7 -> T8ag/6 as you are aware). Does the fog light up when you put it in reverse?
100% this can be coded, and is relatively easy to do.
Maps, hmmm. I don’t think this will be possible for a while. The NAR region does not get the in-car shop for SWaP/FeC like European cars do. I’ve asked about trying to get a SWaP/FeC for my CDN car for MOE (fatigue detection), but it seems like it’s all done though the in-car “shop” now, unlike the MK7 where you could purchase physical codes (came in a package like a DVD!), so I have yet to findd a way to do this. I haven’t tried very hard though, based on people’s disinterest in helping me, and the fact it’s such a silly thing I want to do anyway, haha!
I think you’ll be totally fine re: fuel. As you know, you can run higher octane gas in Canada and the car performs fine (better??).
Having said all that, you really want to ship and go through the pain of importing the car when you can just get a proper Euro one there? I know Canada is one of the cheapest places to buy GTIs and Rs in the world, but the pain of the import process might outweigh the price difference. Further, might you have to pay VAT on import depending where you decide to import it?
Have you considered a Carnet du Passage to temporarily import it?
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Post by dv52 (Australia) on Jun 25, 2024 8:09:22 GMT
e46m OK, I've taken the information below from a NAR model wiring diagram - it shows the factory set-up for the fog-light on the inner left-side tail light (called "Left Tail lamp 2") on a Golf mk8 that is fitted with "bog standard" tail lights:  . . As you can see - I've also included pin-outs for the relevant connectors - hopefully there's sufficient information in my picture to complete your project Whenever I post a wiring diagram, I also prefer to include a description of WV's nomenclature. I'm not sure if this is needed in your case - but here is an example, in case you do: Notice the connection on J519 in my picture labelled T73a /72 KL55. The designations mean: - J519 = the module that OBD11 calls central electrics module
- T73 = A connector which has a Total of 73 x pin positions
- a = The socket on J519 designated as A on the module housing
- /72 = pin #72
- KL55 = DIN 72552 Standard for Bosch designations. In this case "Klemme 55"= fog light .
The other connections in my picture should be read in the same manner. So, as indicated previously, there is a "connection point" on the rear-lid coupling block (THK) in this exercise. Adding the Euro light switch should be very simple. The wiring diagram calls the general combination of light switches the Illumination Control Head (EX59)- which uses LIN communication protocol. This a low-speed single-wire comms facility.
So, whilst there are no wiring changes needed for the Euro light switch, you will need to tell the central electrics module to enable the rear fog-light function on the new switch. To do this - do the following: - Lichtdrehschalter-Light rotary switch with fog tail light > yes
Having set-up the input device for the rear fog-light, you will also need to set-up the new output function - which is the power-supply for the rear fog-light! This is done by activating the Leuchte-set that controls pin #72, Socket A on the central electrics module. Also, you will need to tell the module to energize this pin whenever the rotary-light-switch is in the rear fog-light position. To do this - do the following Leuchte 26 NSL L A72
- Lasttyp 26 > allgemeine_LED_mit_Open_Load_Diagnose_12W
- Lichtfunktion A 26 > NebelschlusslichtwennkeinAnhaengergestecktundRechtsverkehr
- Dimmwert ABC 26 > 127
OK- how to proceed? I suggest a logical step-wise process so there are NO surprises! Maybe start with blizzard60 idea to temporarily energize the fog-light LED in the tail-light as a first try! You certainly can use the "reverse light" method as suggested, or you can simply run a temporary wire with a small amp-value in-line fuse connected at one end to the battery positive - both methods should illuminate the LED if it's operational. If this was my car, I would then install the new Euro light switch and make the coding changes to the central electrics module. This effectively sets-up the module input part of the project. I suggest that you then grab a multi-meter and with the rotary-light-switch on the rear fog-light position - check for full battery-rail voltage at pin #72, Socket A. This will generate error-codes in the central electrics module (because no LED is connected) - but these can easily be cleared.
Having proven that the changes to the central electrics module are correct - I would then make the wiring changes from J519 to the tail-light fitting (you will need to buy a new pin for Socket A)!!
Don
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e46m
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Posts: 6
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Post by e46m on Jun 25, 2024 14:21:46 GMT
blizzard60 Thanks for your reply! To be honest, I'm also pleasantly surprised that NAR tails are the same as Euro "low" units but I'm very happy about this as it makes for less work when I move the car to Europe. Thanks for the suggestions on testing the LED. I'm 99% sure it's there and functional, just needs wiring and coding. Worst case, the LED isn't actually there in which case I would simply buy an used Euro left inner lamp along with the light switch on E-bay for next to nothing. The most important thing is that this can be coded using OBD11 and I'm relieved to hear that it can. re:Maps - what you are saying sounds plausible based on what I've read on other forums. Not sure why VW complicated this so much for themselves as it relates to how SWaP/FeC works in different parts of the world. I have a feeling that I'll need to switch out some hardware in the car in order to be able to get the Euro maps to work. I'm sure someone will figure this out in the future and as I'm not moving to Europe for at least another year, I'm going to be patient and wait for a solution. Worst case, I use some offline map app through apple CarPlay until there's a solution. The fatigue detection sounds like a really cool option, I had no idea this existed on the Mk8. If you ever do figure it out, I'd love to enable that as well. I'm a complete beginner here so I can't help but I do hope you figure this out some day! As for pros and cons of importing vs buying a car in Europe... trust me, I've contemplated long and hard on this. Here's the thing - we needed a car in Canada and after looking at a few different options, we found the GTI to be amazing value and a really nice car for our taste and use cases. We'll be using it here for at least another year at which point selling it means losing most of the money paid for taxes, accessories, tints, winter wheels and tires, etc. plus depreciation. The car has barely any mileage (5,000km at this point) and will not be driven much for the rest of our time here. We really love the car and we think it's a great fit for our lifestyle including what we hope to use it for in Europe. Since the car is made in Germany, and there are barely any differences between EU and NAR models (rear fog, front bumper reflectors and side markers, maps and radio programming, exhaust particulate filter), it will be very easy to import into Europe. Yes, we'll have to pay transport fees and VAT but even then, it will end up being significantly cheaper than buying one there (we paid $46K CAD plus tax for our Performance DSG with sunroof and leather - equivalent in Europe is over 55K Euros plus VAT), especially when I consider how much I would lose if I sell this one and buy another there (money paid for taxes, accessories, tints, winter wheels and tires, etc. plus depreciation). Finally, if I ever decide to bring it back to Canada, I would only pay for transport - no import fees or tax. This is very unlikely as we will probably be moving to Europe permanently. In either case, I can always sell the car there for quite a bit more than I would get in Canada. Who knows, maybe circumstances change and I don't go through with this but at this point, I'm 99% sure. Anyways, thanks again for chiming in - hope to learn lots on here and to be able to contribute in the future. Cheers
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e46m
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Post by e46m on Jun 25, 2024 16:15:03 GMT
dv52 (Australia)Thanks very much for the additional insight and details. You seem to know your stuff and you also seem very thorough - kudos!!! Most of all, I appreciate the code required to enable the fogs - that's what I really needed. To be honest, I still don't have OBDeleven and have no idea how to use it, but once I source the hardware I need, I will be getting familiar with OBDeleven too and may reach out for help at that point, if that's ok. One thing I'd like to confirm though - the J519 (T73a /72 KL55 connection point) is in the front driver footwell, correct? If so, the wire does need to be run from the footwell to the inner left rear lamp, right? Just want to make sure that's the case and that there isn't a connection point somewhere closer to the tail assembly which could save me some time/work.
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Post by dv52 (Australia) on Jun 25, 2024 23:26:40 GMT
I will be getting familiar with OBDeleven too and may reach out for help at that point, if that's ok. Yes, of course it's OK! The sole purpose of forums like this is the sharing of knowledge!! However, I ALWAYS like to extract a quid-pro-quo for advice provided on forums. The word "sharing" in my sentience above implies that knowledge is a two-way facility - so in reciprocity for any advice provided here, I ask that you consider a write-up of your project for the benefit of your fellow forum members- please!!
I'm not sure if you are aware of SFD protection. If not, I suggest that you Google the term because it applies to a Golf mk8 - and read THIS . . . One thing I'd like to confirm though - the J519 (T73a /72 KL55 connection point) is in the front driver footwell, correct? If so, the wire does need to be run from the footwell to the inner left rear lamp, right? Just want to make sure that's the case and that there isn't a connection point somewhere closer to the tail assembly which could save me some time/work.
The central electrics module is item 12 in the diagram below. I'm not sure that location could be called "the front driver footwell" - maybe more like "behind the A pillar", but let's not split-hairs!!
 .
Apropos of your specific question about "a connection point somewhere closer" - I'm not sure! However, what I can say with certainty is that the OEM wiring arrangement doesn't show another coupling-point for the wire route.
Plus, as a general response to your question and because of the economic drivers when determining the amount of copper in modern cars, VW is NOT normally in the habit of using longer cable paths if a shorter route is available. And also in general, the more "breaks" in a wire route for connection points, the higher is the risk of problems!!
So, my strong hunch is that the answer is NO - but I would be delighted to be proven wrong!
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Post by blizzard60 on Jun 26, 2024 6:03:07 GMT
e46m I’ve done this myself, so let me know if you need any guidance or pictures, etc. But it’s super straightforward. 1 wire to the T10 connector at the hatch (the boot/grommet from the body to the hatch can be a pain, but if you run it through with a flexible oil dipstick it’s easy). On the hatch side, continue the wire run, or buy a Euro hatch harness, whatever works for your sensibilities  Over the long weekend, I will try and grab my stock taillight and plug it in to see if the fog activates!
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e46m
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Post by e46m on Jun 26, 2024 13:22:13 GMT
blizzard60 Thanks very much for the help. By chance, do you know the P/N for the pins needed on both ends (J519 connector and rear inner tail connector)? I should be ok with running the wire, I've done this before on other cars. This video seems to have some good tips -
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Post by blizzard60 on Jun 27, 2024 4:48:59 GMT
blizzard60 Thanks very much for the help. By chance, do you know the P/N for the pins needed on both ends (J519 connector and rear inner tail connector)? I should be ok with running the wire, I've done this before on other cars. This video seems to have some good tips - You just want the terminals, or the VW repair wires? If VW repair wires they are 000-979-025-E for both ends, but NOT if you are going to break it at the hatch coupling. That coupling uses 009-E and its male counterpart 012-E. You can buy equivalent terminals from anywhere that sells them including amazon. I buy the genuine TE/Tyco terminals from mouser.ca in Canada. |
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Post by paneuropean on Jun 27, 2024 5:14:41 GMT
The fatigue detection sounds like a really cool option, ... If you ever do figure it out, I'd love to enable that as well... Fatigue Detection is a SWAP (Software as a Product) item that requires a FEC (Feature Enabling Code). This can only be obtained from VW Wolfsburg, and it is not possible to purchase such a FEC for a North American car. I know this because I have already done extensive investigation into enabling this feature on my 2024 'Performance' (Canadian spec) GTI. Michael |
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Post by paneuropean on Jun 27, 2024 5:17:40 GMT
I still don't have OBDeleven and have no idea how to use it... Are you located in the Toronto area? If so, send me a Private Message with your contact info. I have an OBDEleven tool and I can give you an orientation about how to use it. I've also imported vehicle from Canada to Europe in the past and can give you an overview of the headaches involved in doing that. Michael |
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e46m
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Post by e46m on Jun 27, 2024 15:24:38 GMT
paneuropeanI'm located in Kitchener/Waterloo. Thanks very much for your offer to help with OBDEleven. I will surely reach out when I'm ready for this. Also, happy to hear you have experience with importing from Canada to Europe - that will help a lot with my goal of doing the same, granted you don't convince me otherwise... Re:SWAP/FEC - are you stating that VW is refusing to sell this to you? Is that because you're still in the NAR jurisdiction, or because NAR cars are incompatible? Do you think they would be willing to do it if the car is imported into Europe and VIN registered there accordingly?
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Post by paneuropean on Jun 28, 2024 6:18:48 GMT
Re:SWAP/FEC - 1)are you stating that VW is refusing to sell this to you? Correct.2) Is that because you're still in the NAR jurisdiction, or because NAR cars are incompatible? It's because VW AG, the manufacturer, delegates administration of everything related to their vehicles to the importer of the country in which the vehicle is sold (in our case, Canada), and Canada has no capability to sell SwaP/FEC. VW Canada simply isn't interested in that line of business. Neither is VW USA, a different company. 3) Do you think they would be willing to do it if the car is imported into Europe and VIN registered there accordingly? No. VW AG has no interest in getting involved, in fact, they discourage movement of vehicles from one market (NAR) to another (Europe), and the importer in the country you plan to go to in Europe will also have no interest at all in facilitating what you want to do. |
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Post by patktdy on Sept 30, 2024 21:24:46 GMT
Any chance you did attempt the install? I am importing a USA spec car in the UK from Germany and also need to activate/install a rear fog light and this sounds like the OEM+ solution I am looking for.
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