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Post by apache42 on Jun 9, 2023 3:29:00 GMT
Every other scan tool I've ever seen has a way to display the "Readiness Status", to see if a car had completed a proper "drive cycle" in order to do emissions testing.
Where is the "Readiness Status" info screen in odbeleven? I first checked under "Engine", then everywhere else. Can't find it anywhere. What am I missing?
EDIT: yes, I'm using the iOS version of the software
Thanks in advance,
-Ted
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Post by dv52 (Australia) on Jun 9, 2023 20:16:29 GMT
apache42: Hi If you are using iOS version software and AFAIK, I don't believe that that it has the facility for reporting the 8 x readiness counters (happy to be corrected). The Android version of OBD11 does have the readiness facility Don
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Post by apache42 on Jun 10, 2023 15:56:58 GMT
Thanks for the reply Don!
You're correct, I'm using the iOS version of the software.
It's puzzling that this functionality is missing from iOS (and present in Android), as it seems like a fairly simple (and fundamental) piece of functionality.
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Post by dv52 (Australia) on Jun 10, 2023 20:15:37 GMT
apache42 : Yes indeed - it does seem like a relatively simple omission to fix given that the iOS version software is now quite mature!! But, I'm not familiar with the details of this part of the missing software and I'm also not familiar with how the deities on the OBD11 mother-ship decide their priorities!! I guess the best (only) way forward with this matter is to contact the help desk and express your disappointment!! Don
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Post by vwjap on Jun 11, 2023 8:47:06 GMT
I think the iOS version was rushed out and Apple put too many restrictions on their API
Then voltas decided to get the bmw app up and running taking time away, and now their probably working with “other cars”
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Post by dv52 (Australia) on Jun 11, 2023 21:05:35 GMT
vwjap : You might be correct - again, I have no idea how the VOLTAS team determine their priorities. However, adding the readiness indicator to the existing iOS software doesn't seem to be that difficult (at least in theory). This is because much of the work has already been done by the OBD-11 Standard, itself. As you will be aware, returning the performance indicator information is simply a matter of requesting Mode 0, PID01. And in terms of the impact on the existing GUI screens - the changes also seem to be simple! Of course there are many ways of displaying the flags for each test in the returned information - but using VCDS as an example, the test results can be displayed simply as a string of 8 x Bits (i.e. test passed is displayed as Bit = 0, test failed Bit = 1)!! Maybe OBD11 software should allow users to request PIDs directly - but this is probably way too geeky to be commercially viable!! 
Don
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Post by vwjap on Jun 11, 2023 21:22:24 GMT
Isn’t there like 180 pid’s in service 0?
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Post by dv52 (Australia) on Jun 11, 2023 22:51:04 GMT
vwjap : Yes, there are lots of PIDs - I'm not sure of the total number If you think about how the existing OBD11 software works - it sends a small sub-section of available PIDs to the car's modules and it arranges the resulting data from module responses via preset GUI screens (yes, this is a gross simplification - but it's ostensibly that simple!!). I suspect the more difficult (and more expensive) component of OBD11 software is the latter part (i.e. data-interpretation and GUI assignment)
In my suggestion for directly inputting PIDs - I didn't mean that the OBD11 software should interpret the resulting data in any way. Instead, I was thinking that the OBD11 software would just provide a data dump of the information from the modules to the user (in a flat-file format). It would then be the user's responsibility to unpack and to interpret the data file using information in the public domain.
But, as I said - probably way too geeky and far too noncommercial to be a serious suggestion!!
Don
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Post by apache42 on Jun 12, 2023 15:36:35 GMT
Updates:
1) I borrowed an Android phone, installed ODBeleven, and verified that the Readiness screen is indeed there
2) today I received the following reply from ODBeleven:
I replied as follows:
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Post by dv52 (Australia) on Jun 12, 2023 22:08:45 GMT
apache42 : not sure why the help-desk denied the existence of the readiness function on their software - I guess it's a simple example of an error (it happens - no one gets it right 100%!!). However, the help desk is correct about the plethora of emission related stuff in the live-data part of the ECU - worth a look IMO!! I personally don't use the readiness function much because Australia doesn't have regulations like MOT examinations. That said, I sometimes like to refer to the readiness flags when diagnosing faults because it can sometimes disclose when the owner cleared module error memory!! BUT there is value in numbers - if you are evangelical about adding this facility to the iOS version software, I suggest that you get others to support your campaign Don
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Post by apache42 on Jun 15, 2023 18:59:00 GMT
I actually did look in the "live data" section for the Engine module, and it just presented a TextEdit box asking for a channel number ("Channel 1 - 254:").
I tried about 50 different numbers, and there seems to be no logical structure. It's just random information.
Furthermore, none of live data channels seemed to equate to any of the dozen or so lines of "Readiness" data I saw on the Android version of the app (which actually does have a "Readiness" screen).
Perhaps the "Readiness" data is in the "live data" of a different ODBeleven module?
It just seems like not having a "Readiness" screen on iOS is an enormous functionality flaw.
After all, the entire (original) purpose of ODBII is to check the status of a car's emissions system.
In many states/countries, having an annual car safety inspection is required.
A key part of that inspection is verifying that the emissions systems are functioning.
That emissions functionality can't be checked until the car has passed it's emissions "Readiness" tests.
There are more than a few threads where people have driven their car to the inspection station,
only to be told "you need to drive it around more first". It would be nice to know ahead of time if
the "Readiness" state has been achieved or not. Via ODBeleven. On an iPhone (iOS).
FYI, I actually did get a second reply from the help desk. They basically said "it's hard to port this
functionality to iOS, and in fact it doesn't even work all the time on Android".
They then sent me to "their huge fan base" on this and Facebook forums. I kid you not:
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Post by dv52 (Australia) on Jun 15, 2023 22:19:37 GMT
@apatche42: OK -the help desk is just trying to be helpful - i guess !!! I actually did look in the "live data" section for the Engine module, and it just presented a TextEdit box asking for a channel number ("Channel 1 - 254:"). I tried about 50 different numbers, and there seems to be no logical structure. It's just random information. hmm......... this is a defining observation!!!
I've been doing this stuff for many years - but here's the thing about how forums like this work: Often authors of posts on this forum don't disclose specific information about the car in their questions (meaning the car model and build year). This omission when it happens is a huge deficiency because as you will appreciate - NONE of VW's different models are built the same.
So - because you placed your post in the mk7 part of the forum without disclosing any other specific data about this car, I (and I suspect vwjap too) assumed that the vehicle is a Golf mk7!!
Now - a Golf mk7 is built on a MQB platform and more importantly, these cars ALL use modules that have the newer style UDS/ODX protocols. These newer protocols use text based words to identify the module's internal facilities. Older (non-UDS) modules that were installed in previous version Golfs did NOT use text-based descriptors - instead, they use a number based system which is based on hexadecimal arithmetic. Hex numbers have a decimal arithmetic equivalent which range from 0 to 255 for a single hex-pair
So, if OBD11 screen is asking for a channel number - it kind-of means that this car uses the older style (non-UDS) engine module. This kind-of means that this car is NOT a Golf mk7. What am I missing?
Don
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Post by apache42 on Jun 17, 2023 7:54:16 GMT
Apologies for my delayed reply, I'm used to forums which send email notices when new replies get added to the threads. I haven't been receiving any notices, so I need to manually remember to check back periodically.
To answer your question: this is a 2014 GTI, based in the USA. In the US models, the mk6 range is 2010-2014. This often causes a bit of confusion, as for other countries mk6 ended with the 2013 model year.
Why am I posting in the mk7 section instead of the mk6 section? Because... the mk6 forum has far less traffic, and I thought I'd have a much better chance of getting an answer in the mk7 forum and... I had assumed that the answers for my ODBII questions would be essentially the same for both mk6 and mk7.
Hopefully I haven't offended anyone by "cheating" and using the mk7 forum...
But I take your point that mk7's switched to text-based labels, whereas earlier models used integers.
So my assumption that mk6 ODBII q's are essentially the same as mk7 is not true.
However... even mk6 has to have some sort of underlying ODBII data... that would constitute the values which indicate "Readiness". But I have no idea where they're coming from, as I've now gone through every single one of the 254 channels and not one of them had any info remotely similar to the "Readiness" lines which I see when using and Android phone (and ODBEleven).
Also (FYI), I'm actually a software engineer and have coded low-level protocols (eg, SCSI disk diagnostics). Just wanted to let you know... so that you don't have to spend the extra effort to break things down in layman terms (eg, hex numbers) :-)
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Post by dv52 (Australia) on Jun 17, 2023 8:59:27 GMT
apache42 : No offense taken - I was just trying to understand why your vehicle was asking for a channel number when such a request was not possible for MQB platform vehicles!! Also good to read that you can hold an intelligent conversation in hex speak !
Anyhow - yes, if this is a mk6 Golf - then it will have a PQ35 platform and it will use modules that don't comply with the newer UDS/ODX protocols. This means that everything in the module will be based on numbered channels (rather than using text-based descriptors)
As you will appreciate, because I live in the very, very deep South - I don't get to see many (any) "Yankee" cars - which are called "North America Region" (NAR) models, That said, I am aware that lots of stuff on your cars are different up there and NAR model Golfs are no exception.
Nevertheless - since this car was built in 2014, the Engine Controller should be OBD-II compliant (I understand that all 1996 and newer US-Models are compliant) This means that you should be able to manually force the generation of the Readiness codes on this car (I think, or rather-I hope).
Now, I have to admit that I have not personally done this process using OBD11 and I most certainly haven't done this process on a NAR model - but I reckon that it's worth trying!
The procedure for forced generation of the Readiness Codes on UDS/ODX modules is relatively easy: simply run Automatic test sequence in Basic settings in the ECU @ address hex01. In UDS/ODX engine modules after initiating Basic Settings, the operator holds a foot on the brake pedal and floors the accelerator pedal, while the engine controller holds different RPM points and runs through all of the tests.
However, the same forced Readiness Code procedure on earlier engine modules involves separately running each of the flag-test processes individually. From my time on the Ross-tech forum - the instruction-set for forced generation of Readiness codes on earlier engine modules can be found HERE in VCDS speak
As I have said, I haven't personally done this with OBD11 - so you will need to intuit how the steps translate to the OBD11 screens - but, the individual processes are embedded in the module (they are not in the diagnostic device) - so the OBD11 process should be similar to VCDS!
Don
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Post by apache42 on Jun 20, 2023 19:09:44 GMT
Wow, thanks for the link to that Ross-tech article, that was pretty fascinating!
I actually do have VCDS (bought it years ago), so I can use those instructions directly, without even having to "translate" them into ODBeleven menu clicks. Nice!
Also thanks for the PQ35 tidbit. I knew mk6 wasn't on the MQB platform, but wasn't sure what it was. Now I have another keyword for my future searches.
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